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Talk:Kal-El (New Earth)
Problems This is a very poor summary of the Superman comics. There is little to no distinction between the Pre-Crisis and Post-Crisis characters. Each has a different history and here they seem mixed in with onfe another. (unsigned by Bcardarella) :While we always welcome critizism and suggestions, this database is freely editable by all. We would really appreciate your expertise if you could re-organize the article and add what missing information you have! :Welcome to the DC Database Project! :--Jamie 21:53, 7 March 2006 (Eastern Standard Time) Will do :I think it's more than missing data. With the recent reboot a lot of this past information is not relevant. And should be in pages of their own for Pre/Post Crisis histories. Am I wrong? I would take part, but I feel I wouldn't be able to focus properly - (Lone Hunter 19:58, April 17, 2012 (UTC)) ::The talkpage post you're responding to is six years old, and the Superman page has undergone a SIGNIFICANT revamping since then. ::* Pre-Crisis history for Superman can be found here: Superman (Earth-One), and here: Superman (Earth-Two). ::* The origins for all of the various different versions of Superman can be found here: Superman Origins. ::At the moment, the Superman page contains information for the Modern Age version of the character, from Crisis on Infinite Earths up to Flashpoint, and then the DCnU - which is the same universe (different timeline). - Hatebunny 20:08, April 17, 2012 (UTC) Soulvision and Vegetariansim It's rare for me to leave my own comments on these pages, but I feel compelled to do so in a minor way, given how many hours I've spent dedicated to the Man of Steel's page. I dislike the decision to change Clark into a vegetarian. I think this is a perfect example of how a writer can be out of touch with the subject manner. Clark grew up on a farm--a farm with livestock. I have met many farmers who grew up and worked under such conditions, but I have never met a single one who was a vegetarian. Bear in mind, these are the people who watch chicks hatch out of eggs, grow up, and then proceed to cut the heads off said chickens. These are the people who help birth calves and then slaughter them later. Farmers are perfectly capable of looking a cow in the eyes in the afternoon and then eating a Rib-eye for dinner that night. Of course, Waid tied it to his decision to give Clark "soulvision." I'm actually torn over this. Personally, I do believe in such things as God and souls, but on the other hand, I think that it was not necessary to give Superman an extra power that is in some ways redundant--he can HEAR a person's breath go out, or their heart stop for pete's sake. --Duoraven December 21, 2006 :I agree with you that often writers try and capture the 'zeitgeist' and incorporate it into popular heroes of the time. I also agree this is usually a gimmick and mostly shallow. With that said, pretty much all of the 'popular' characters got that way because the reader can easily identitify with one aspect or another. While making him a vegan might lose 100 readers, it might invite 1000 new (vegan) ones. It is a risk that hopefully DC has calculated. :Just my take on it. :--Jamie 21:29, 21 December 2006 (UTC) ::As of Action Comics Vol 1 850, Kal-El is no longer a vegetarian and is back to eating Beef Wellington as his favorite food so how much of the structure of the character from Birthright remains unsure at this time. Though that part of him being near lightspeed and capable of infinite power is definitely NOT correct. Though some writers will probably try to adapt that as part of the main character --Kal-l-fan 08 Jun 2007 :Yep. Looks like Clark is back to eating meat, so I'm guessing the vegetarianism and having "soul vision" thing is no longer in. :--Cluebert 11:34, 15 Jan 2008 (UTC) Hoping to improve this article a little I relocated the publishing history and Birthright info to the Superman disambig page. That should (hopefully) keep all of the out-of-universe stuff out of this main history section. I also reformatted Superman: Birthright and included the relative info there as well. See the history file for this page however for full authorship credit. I'm going to reformat the main page with the template, and hopefully it will yield a sleeker looking article. I realize this may seem kind of rash at first, but if anyone has any strong objections, we can always revert any edits at a later time. --Brian Kurtz 02:20, 19 May 2007 (UTC) Superman Family I think we should do a Superman Family article what do you think? -- Awar 00:40, 8 June 2007 (UTC). *No offense but what "Superman Family"? The original Superman Family included many characters who are no longer interacting in that way that the original book of the same name had and would be missing the biggest element Kal-L and his wife Lois Lane-Kent along with all the supplementary characters. Unless you are basically going to limit the inclusion to just what SEEMS to be the return of Superman's interaction with Supergirl, there is no real reason to include it.--Kal-l-fan 08 Jun 2007 **I mean like what was done with the Batman Family, I dont mean like the EL family line! -- Awar 04:24, 8 June 2007 (UTC). ***I understood that and again the book called the Superman family was inclusive of Kal-L and Lois-Lane Kent, Superboy, Jimmy Olsen as Elongated Lad and his own non powered adventures, Krypto and other members of the surviving Kandor populace. All of these characters are no longer in active use. So unless you are making instance on just the current Superman and his wife and the back and forth nature with the current Supergirl as the co called Superman Family (don't want to give away the situation with Power Girl), again there is no reason for such other than as a historic reference as there is no Superman Family. ****Did you even look at the Batman Family article?, Think of it more of a Team than a Family (family dose not have to mean genetic) with information on memebers wheather there active inactive deceased. information on their enemys, allies, history, weapons, technology, base of operation stuff like that! -- Awar 06:09, 8 June 2007 (UTC). *****Again Superman does NOT need a support team precisely because of his nature as one of the most powerful beings in existence. That was one of the reasons that in the recast history he was not one of the founding members of the Justice League as basically he does NOT need them. The Superman Family was an extended idea based on trying to show Superman more human in his adventures and appreciative to his adopted home and its people in Kal-L, and for the Earth-One version alongside his LARGE amount of retconned Kandor based survivors. In the current reality there is no need for Superman Family as he has his foster parents still alive and has no direct surviving members other than Supergirl who his relationship with currently is at best iffy and Superman does NOT rely on Jimmy as a hero in the current reality and Conner is dead. So unless you are either going to go on the erased events of the Pre-Crisis reality or limit your events to that of the current Kal-El and his wife and Supergirl (which again is not reliable) there is no Superman Family to speak of. ******You are the one that fails to get it, The past did happen, he has needed help, his powers have always changed from writter to writter and his dose/did have Supergirl (Kara Zor-El), Supergirl (Linda Danvers), Superboy (Kon-El/Conner Kent), Krypto etc as part of his team/extended family at some point. It did happen it is cannon get over it! -- Awar 13:06, 8 June 2007 (UTC). Sub-light? New Earth Superman can move at lightspeed. I dont like the way that everyone is talking about all of this 2000 mps stuff. 1% of lightspeed? Come on, the guy flew from Earth to the andromeda galaxy in as long as it took Superman-prime to slaughter 30 green lanterns... and that wasn't long. The andromeda galaxy is approximately 2.5 million light-years away. It would take light from Earth 2 and a half million years to get there... and superman made it in less than an hour. Then there is the fact that he is somehow able to fly to the source wall, which is at the edge of the universe, etc... My point is that superman is AT LEAST lightspeed, if not way faster. According to recent comics. :Hi. For some reason, we have a bunch of Post-Crisis Superman entries. If you mean the latest one (current publications), that would be this one. For some reason. I think he's faster than light too. ;-) ::--Roygbiv666 16:29, 9 January 2008 (UTC) ::For sure Roygbiv666. More faster than even the fastest bullet, etc, etc.... ::--Cluebert 5:48 20 January 2008 (UTC) Merging? Hey Roygbiv666 and anybody else, do u think we ought to merge the whole Kal-El (New Earth) category with this one? Technically, I know that TPTB have wrote in Action Comics that Superman was born before being sent to Earth instead of in a birthing matrix, but Superman (Post-Crisis) and Superman (New Earth) are still the one and the same. Just because they have done some revisioning over the last while doesn't mean that everything about John Byrne and following writers (Supes' first encounter with Batman, first fight with Bizarro, etc) is now worthless and jettisoned. Sure, they have a few kinks and differences, but DC Comics did not say they would be getting rid of "everything" that was done in the last nearly twenty years. They only changed the aspects of Kal-El's birth, revised Krypton, and re-introduced some things not shown in years like Mon-El, Legion of Superheroes, etc. It is known that Clark was a football player in his youth, had a crush on Lana and revealed the truth to her, blah blah blah. ::--Cluebert 5:55 20 January 2008 (UTC) I suppose and it does make sense, but at the same time isn't this comparable to the changes effected after Crisis on Infinite Earths in MOS? When that happened, DC stated that some of his stories from the Silver Age would still apply - so in a way, yes the stories from the last 20 years are the same. I suppose the question would be if now after Infinite Crisis, it really is a 'New Age' or not since for example, apparently now Superman and Batman get along on more cordial terms and Lex Luthor is back to running around in that powered suit. The Crisis of recording what happened before a Crisis I'm pretty new to the DC Wiki (I mostly post stuff over on the Marvel one) and I have to admit that I'm pretty new at figuring out some of the headaches both Crisis on Infinite Earth's and Infinite Crisis have caused in revamps of characters, but perhaps I can give an "outsiders" perspective, not just of the Superman article, but a lot of the other ones I've read on here. I suppose what I'm used to seeing in terms of profiles of characters, is in the typical "Official Handbook" exhaustive profiles of characters, and I can see how applying some of the stuff (Especially the pre-Crisis stuff *phew* I don't envy the person who writes a profile for Earth-One Superman in extensive detail) would require a lot of research, but I think for the sake of clarity and to present all the facts, even if in the current revamp are irrelevant would be the best way to go. And perhaps the best way to properly address everything, and be sure that nothing is left out (For example, the Pre-Crisis and Post-Crisis versions of Superman mentioned above and how Post-Infinite Crisis changes things around as well) perhaps it's best to have different profiles for each incarnation. That is done for some characters on here (For example Batman of Earth-One, Earth-Two and New-Earth) where others these details are not identified (The Justice League of America profile) with separate versions. It seems the biggest blurring point is when we've got a character (like Superman of Earth-One and the Justice League) that weren't completely re-written but revamped as a result of the various changes wrought by whichever Crisis effected things. Perhaps splitting up a characters profile into these distinctions would be best. Like for example, Earth-One Superman... Do a Pre-Crisis entry, explain everything as it was told up until Crisis on Infinite Earths. Do a new heading explaining how that Crisis changed Superman's history and then break into a new profile for Post-Crisis Superman. Post-Crisis Superman you go into Bryne's origins, tell his history up until the next big reality shaker that revamped his origins ...Did Armageddon and Zero Hour effect him that profoundly? I wouldn't know really... which I guess would be Infinite Crisis.... End the profile with an explanation how that further revamped Supes origins and end the profile there and start a new one for the Post-Infinite-Crisis-New-Earth Superman, which by and large is a work in progress naturally since that's still fresh. Anyway, that's my suggestion, I like the work people do here, it's a great archive of knowledge, but the completest in me wants to know all, and I suppose the best way of doing that would be to have it all, every incarnation and instead of going back and re-writing something that's been retconned or rendered not applicable due to some revamp or another, just explain how a certain event changed the course of things. Dunno what you all think, I guess I'm just typing out loud ;) Comments? ::--Nausiated 6:09 29 January 2008 My Thanks Id like to thank the one, who made this article...Very nice :(Unsigned by Lordseid) Usage I don't really understand the difference between the two primary Superman articles. I'm sure there is one, I'm just too lazy to go through and read all of the pages. Could somebody explain to me when I'm supposed to use this character, instead of the New Earth version? :- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 05:01, 11 September 2008 (UTC) :BUMP ::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 03:42, 15 September 2008 (UTC) :::BUMPPPPPPP. Sorry, it's just killing me that I'm very well listing incorrect appearances frequently. ::::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 03:16, 2 October 2008 (UTC) :::Believe me when I say, I appreciate your frustration. Personally, I LOATHE the idea of having two separate pages for what is in effect a single continuity. Bugs the crap out of me. Unfortunately, Superman: Birthright created an irreconcilable continuity quagmire (Say THAT five times real fast!). The histories of both versions are completely incompatible with one another, owing largely to the radical changes in Kryptonian culture. :::But, to answer your question: For appearances sake, I would list all Supes appearances from October 1986 to August 2003 as Kal-El (Post-Crisis) and everything from September 2003 (the cover date to Birthright #1) to the present as Kal-El (New Earth). The same holds true for Ma and Pa Kent and Jor-El and Lara. All of the other Supes supporting cast should be fine as is. --Brian Kurtz 04:23, 2 October 2008 (UTC) I haven't used it once ever, and I've been doing a lot of 90s work lately. They're supposed to be cleaning up Supes' origin anyway, though. Just what exactly is the discrepancy? :- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 05:21, 2 October 2008 (UTC) ::We could use Tabs to differentiate the different versions. ANyone? ::Roygbiv666 13:45, 4 December 2008 (UTC) Superman: Birthright Should Birthright continuity count as "New Earth"? The Clever Guy (Talk • • ) 16:48, 14 September 2007 (UTC) : It is being ignored, or replaced, slowly. MaGnUs Current power descriptions In the hopes of preventing a potential edit war, I recommend keeping Superman's power levels as they are currently presented (as per the December 18th, 2007 17:50 edit by Kal l fan). Using RPG or game statistics to gauge power levels is fine so long as they do not contradict information supplied in the comic books. The comics themselves should always be considered the most authoritative information source. If the comics present Superman with FTL flight capability or the potential to lift in excess of 100,000 tons, than yes, the article should most certainly be updated. --Brian Kurtz 19:48, 18 December 2007 (UTC) There is also no mention of Superman's powers under a blue sun environment. He went to a planet to rescue Pa Kent. The planet was orbiting a blue sun. Jor-El even mentioned that his powers were enhanced and even got a new power. The power that he found and was coined by Pa Kent was called "Superman-Vision" or bio-enhancement. This means that Superman can give humans powers like his under a blue sun. It was an accident when he accidentally hit Pa with this new power and Pa was uninjured when Bizarro- Doomsday hit him. Just wanted to know let others know because New Earth Bizarro had a new power under a blue sun world and it was not mentioned for Superman. Hey, just joined this database a couple days ago and wanted to see if editing Superman's Powers and Abilities to be less contradictory would start an unwanted editing war. For example, in his Super Speed it says that he can fly in excess of lightspeed in normal space (which is definitely true) but at the end it states that he can only reach 1% of lightspeed. This is confusing to someone who's just starting to read about the Man of Steel. And it should also be mentioned that the only reason he doesn't fly faster than light on Earth is because he doesn't want to cause damage to it, like his Super Strength. Oh and I was also wondering if we could add his Super Scream back to the page. The one he used to cancel out a nuclear detonation. --x Man of Steel x-- ::Go for it. As long as you're doing it intelligently. Some people... don't. :::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 16:49, 10 May 2009 (UTC) :::Yup - you can't overdo citations. Well, I suppose you could, but I've yet to see it happen. :::Roygbiv666 17:49, 10 May 2009 (UTC) Another question? Why is his strength level only considered 100 tons when we all know he can easily reach over 100,000? If there is a good reason, I'll leave it alone. I just don't understand. :For reasons unclear (probably the original Marvel Handbook), "100 tons" became an arbitrary high end strength designation. So, usually, characters get listed by 100+ or something. If you can cite a specific source for more, please do so. I think the old Who's Who entry says he can lift the Great Pyramid of Cheops, which is apparently 6,000,000 tons. :Also, don't forget to sign your posts by putting four of these little symbols at the end, like this: ~~~~ ::Roygbiv666 17:38, 30 May 2009 (UTC) :Anybody have a citation for "generally accepted that his strength easily surpasses the capacity to lift 900,000,000 tons"? : 03:43, February 25, 2010 (UTC) ::anything that says generally accepted should be reverted on the spot as far as I'm concerned. :::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 05:10, February 25, 2010 (UTC) Superman's Invulnerability Superman never used a forcefield, Tempest's magic, or a power Ring to protect him when he flew into Earth's yellow Sun during Our Worlds at War Saga. Tempest's magic was used to help open a Boom Tube to the begining of time. Superman did it before when he lost his powers during the Final Nught Crisis. He Boom Tubed in with Metron Of the New Gods in a ship. The ship and the Force Field burned up as soon as they flew in and He immerged from the Sun fully charged. And still flew around looking for Metron inside the Sun. Flying into the Sun has shown to have adverse effects to the Superman from the Alternate universe Storyline,"All Star Superman". Please consider revising. Superboy So, now that Superboy's back in continuity... that's like a shitload of new stuff we need to add onto this page, huh? :- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 01:32, October 23, 2009 (UTC) No, I don't think so. The new Superboy has NOTHING to due with Clark's past before becoming Superman. It's his clone... J. A. R. Head 01:03, December 15, 2009 (UTC) ::Not Conner Kent, I was talking about the recent events in . :::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 01:33, December 15, 2009 (UTC) GREAT! This is just wonderful... I was SO glad that there wasn't a Superboy past... Whatever. IDK, I think, maybe, we could just post "Secret Origin" at the top. Maybe not much is changed in the story enough where we won't have to change EVERYTHING. :It fundamentally alters the nature of his youth in smallville, and retcons the Post-Crisis character back into a crapload of old Legion of Super-Heroes stories. ::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 05:24, December 15, 2009 (UTC) Although, it may, let's just put it at top, like I said. If anything changes about him becoming Superman, then we can add it. But, for now, let's just see how far this series goes.J. A. R. Head 00:46, December 28, 2009 (UTC) I think it may be canon with the original Man of Steel/Birthright comics... Mainly due to Superman vol. 1 #676 being based before the events of Man of Steel#5. J. A. R. Head 00:46, December 28, 2009 (UTC) ::Okay, how's this for a solution? Maybe the same way we have Superboy (Earth-One) we could have Superboy (New Earth) and have a separate page talking about his adventures and the discrepancies so that this page isn't fifty million miles long. Seeing as how he hasn't been around for all of Superman's recent history, they're practically separate characters anyway. :::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 08:04, August 27, 2010 (UTC) Supergirl Where can we add the Superman/Batman story???? J. A. R. Head 00:49, January 6, 2010 (UTC) World of New Krypton Yeah, I appreciate the work that went into this, but does the "World of New Krypton" section need to be that detailed? Can't we summarize it in a paragraph or two and put in a link to the storyline? : 23:41, February 25, 2010 (UTC) :So ... nobody then? : 21:33, March 16, 2010 (UTC) ::I raised the issue on Leader Vladimir's talk page, but haven't got a response. However, I'm not reading World of New Krypton (planned to get the trades) so I can't properly condense it. If you can, by all means have a go. -- SFH 21:59, March 16, 2010 (UTC) :I absolutely agree. This is suppose to be a history of Kal-El, not a synopsis of World of New Krypton. Perhaps on the Kal-El page, we can provide a brief overview of that event in his life, and a link to the World of New Krypton Event...? Goblyn4evil 20:30, July 14, 2010 (UTC) Far Too Detailed I sincerely hope several here agree that portions of this article are far too detailed. Check The Beginning. It jumps from a small mentioning of Lara and Pete in Smallville, to a full synopsis of, what I believe is, the entire Secret Origins storyline. I haven't read any more than that, because frankly, I fear the worst. I for one believe this page should get a major overhaul, and have most (if not everything) rewritten and condensed. Does anyone agree? --KratosGodofWar (Radi0n) 19:33, December 27, 2010 (UTC) :Yeah, it's a known problem. Billy redid Batman a while back, but Supes needs the same treatment. If entire storylines are pressed into the character pages, next thing we'll have is pages as shitass big as Wookieepedia. They're a hell to navigate. -- [[User:Tupka217|Tupka]][[User talk:Tupka217|''217]] 19:52, December 27, 2010 (UTC) Time to change the image? Maybe , there's no reason to keep it static. : 18:21, May 28, 2011 (UTC) ::I agree that it should be changed to something more recent (I'm the guy who put it on the current one), but I've been trying to find something current and really good that strongly showcases him... that one is a little Lois-heavy. The one from the ending of Superman: Secret Origin is really strong, but I haven't been able to find a virgin image of that anywhere (I know for a fact that there is one in the collected edition). The one on the disambig is also one of my favorites, but I hate using the same image for a main article and the disambig. This is another really good one by Gary Frank. :::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 19:00, May 28, 2011 (UTC) :Geez, this reminds me... I really need to put some more work into the Superman gallery. I've almost reached 600 on the Batman gallery and it's possibly I can give Bruce a rest at this point. ::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 19:03, May 28, 2011 (UTC) Post-Flashpoint History Since the Flashpoint event will retcon Superman's entire history (except ''Death of Superman), does that mean that we will have to re-write the entire article, or create a new article for the post-Flashpoint Superman? Leader Vladimir 16:30, August 20, 2011 (UTC) DCnU/The New 52/Post-Flashpoint Since many major events in Superman's history, like the Kents, his personality and his powers, have been heavily altered, does anyone we should create a new article for the Post-Flashpoint Superman, separate fro the Post-Crisis/New Earth version? I mean, there are different articles for the Kal-L of Earth-Two, the Kal-El of Earth-One and Superman of New Earth. So why shouldn't there be a different article for the Post-Flashpoint Superman? Superman 12:12, September 10, 2011 (UTC) :We're not making new characters for anyone in the New 52 because if we did then we'd have to make new pages for all of them, and that would be more confusing than helpful for newer readers. They're basically the same character in different circumstances, it's easier to write about them that way then divide everything up. ::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 14:28, September 10, 2011 (UTC) You really don't think it's more confusing for a newer reader to come into the page being assaulted with an onslaught of information (most not canon anymore) then create a brand new page for Post-Flashpoint? No disrespect but I think that's more laziness than consideration on our parts. X Man of Steel x 16:54, September 18, 2011 (UTC) Look, why don't we vote about it? And I agree with x Man of Steel x, it's more confusing than helpful. Put my vote down as NEW PAGE. Superman 11:04, September 20, 2011 (UTC) :The alternative would be having one character and his history divided up into multiple pages, so yeah, I do think this is less confusing for new readers. We're showing the changes against each other for context, because our articles are supposed to provide a historical perspective on these characters. Should we also make new pages for him Post-Birthright and Post-Secret Origin? Maybe we should make a new page every time there's a retcon so people don't get confused. We're not going to have our main page for the oldest super-hero start his appearances in 2011. ::- Billy Arrowsmith (Talk), 16:11, September 20, 2011 (UTC) No, not every time, just when there's a major retcon, like the DCnU. If the DCnU Superman is the same as the New Earth one, wouldn't the Earth-1 and Earth-2 versions also be the same, just under different different circumstances? The DCnU Superman is as much of a different character from the New Earth version as the New Earth Kal-El is from the Earth-1 and Earth-2 versions. Superman 22:40, September 20, 2011 (UTC) I have to agree: This article about Superman should be broken up into several different articles. There should be one article for each rebooted universe and each of the retcons. I know, I know: DC keeps rebooting their universe while being ambiguous about what is and what is not cannon anymore, so it would be a lot of work to sift through it all. But if you lump all these different iterations of Superman together in one article and call it all New Earth that's no way to run an encyclopedia. What we have now is a confusing mish-mash of text written at various points in the publication history of the post-crisis Superman, with no clear way to know what was in cannon when, or in which universe or retcon. This policy of just lumping everything together and calling it all New Earth is stupid, lazy, and a great way to run this wiki into the ground. Oh, and nobody's buying this line that the DCnU is not a reboot. We're not morons, we know a reboot when we see it. Stop insisting that it's all still the same universe as the pre-Flashpoint universe; Don't make me come over there and beat you over the head with Stormwatch. DCSarge 16:03, January 6, 2012 (UTC) Shouldn't this page be called Superman (Kal-El) instead of Superman (Clark Kent)? Other Superman pages have 'Kal-El' in the title so why is this page called Superman (Clark Kent)? :It's moved for search engine optimization. The actual page is Superman (Clark Kent), but it's treated as Kal-El (New Earth) on issue pages. Clark Kent is chosen over Kal-El because that's his secret identity, and more people will be searching for that name. People searching for Kal-El will end up on the page as well. --'[[User:Tupka217|Tupka']][[User talk:Tupka217|''217]] 09:11, October 18, 2011 (UTC) Image I don't know about the rest of you, but the current image isn't very good, I mean, you can hardly see ye ol' S-Shield. Shouldn't we use an image like this or this? Rassilon 02:03, December 4, 2011 (UTC) Is his name still Clark Joseph Kent? Since Superman's history has gotten rebooted, do we know if he still has a middle name? If not, then shouldn't his name be changed to Clark Kent? NetSpiker 04:37, January 18, 2012 (UTC) :That seems a little unnecessary. We could fill this site over again with stuff we don't know so far. Besides, most people have middle names. Its better to have the info than remove it because we don't know if its true now. Kyletheobald 05:58, January 18, 2012 (UTC) ::Infinite Crisis: Secret Files & Origins shows that the Earth-2 Superman and Superboy-Prime do not have the middle name Joseph and that the Earth-2 Lois Lane does not have the middle name Joanne. An episode of Lois & Clark: The New Adventures Of Superman revealed that Clark's middle name is Jerome. All of this leads me to believe that the middle name Joseph is exclusive to one particular continuity: the post-Crisis pre-Flashpoint continuity. I think Clark Joseph Kent should be moved to the aliases section, rather than completely removed. At least until someone makes a separate page for DCnU Superman. NetSpiker 07:11, January 18, 2012 (UTC) :::You do know that, as a site, we decided not to create new pages for "DCnU", right? Check out Talk:DCnU for all the reasons why and the plan going forward. Kyletheobald 07:20, January 18, 2012 (UTC) This should be DCnU Superman I would really appreciate it if this page was made separate from the DCnU version of Superman, in fact the DCnU Superman should be made the default page, NOT New Earth Superman. I am a new DC reader, just starting out with the new 52 in fact, and it took me well over an hour just to find any information at all on this wikia about the DCnU Superman. I was able to find it here, but only under a mountain of other information completely irrelevant to the rebooted and OFFICIALLY canon timeline. New Earth Superman or Earth-One Superman needs to be it's own page and "DCnU" Superman should be made the default Superman article. PizzaRolls 06:22, February 18, 2012 (UTC) : In order to semi-resolve this issue, I did what I've been doing on all of the pages I've been looking after, which is to use the table of contents as a jumping point straight to DCnU content. I know it's not what Billy would do, but it helps in a minor way. - Hatebunny 17:54, February 18, 2012 (UTC) Superman I think Superman's picture in the character template is not good enough. i would perfer a more close up and more better looking picture of him like most of the others. Does anyone agree? If so i would love to replace the picture with a better one. :For the record, simply posting on the talk page does not count as consultation, but I'm not opposed to the change. - Hatebunny (talk) 15:47, March 4, 2013 (UTC) :We're going to need a new, pre-New 52 pic, I agree. But like Hatebunny said, you cannot bypass discussion. You ignored a note about not changing the image, twice. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']][[Message wall:Tupka217|''217]] 15:50, March 4, 2013 (UTC) Look, i dont know much about how everything works here so i will have to know how to do things right next time.-Super C93 :It says to on the page. Right after the image you changed. DO NOT CHANGE. Go back to the page, you'll see it's there. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 16:20, March 4, 2013 (UTC) I'm not sure if the discussion is already over but I agree with a picture change. The picture we have right now is really cool, but I agree we should change it for a closer pic. Maybe the one near the DCnU section of the new costume? --- Harold "The Party" Rocks talk 21:24, March 4, 2013 (UTC) :Nope. It needs to be the old costume, as the new stuff has to be split off. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 21:28, March 4, 2013 (UTC) :Oh yeah. Slipped my mind. Haha. Nevermind, then. --- Harold "The Party" Rocks talk 23:36, March 4, 2013 (UTC) Has anyone agreed to change his picture yet? -Super C93 :It's probably safe to say that if someone yelled at you for trying to change it that nobody agrees with you. - Hatebunny (talk) 02:24, March 21, 2013 (UTC) Im quiting this site, there's just to many rules and no one is being very nice.-super C93 Cover Image? I'm new to the whole wiki editing thing and I think I have the right term here. I would like to change the image of Superman holding the Daily Planet planet above his head and being angry to something a little different. - j.scortino :If you'll look over the conversation immediately above this one, you'll see that while we do need to change the image, we don't want people just up and changing it to whatever they think is better whenever they want. It's a very highly trafficked page, so it's best not to have the image changing every few days, at users' whims. That said, if you have one in mind, link it here, and we'll have a look at it. - Hatebunny (talk) 02:12, March 22, 2013 (UTC) :: Yeah I noticed the discussion shortly after I posted mine. I understand the reasoning behind it and I don't fully understand if we're going to go with a pre/post crisis pic or a new 52 one. - J.scortino :::I actually have no idea how to link the images here but I have then saved to my phone if you wanna message your email address to me I can email them to the you. J.scortino Superman's relative In the Relatives section, Superman is still noted as being married to Lois despite the universe "rebooting" itself, considering what I just mentioned Superman's marital status should be Dating not Married and as Diana and Clark haven't been mentioned as having broke up it would mean they are still dating. --Superior Spider-Man (talk) 09:21, July 5, 2013 (UTC) :This page is for the New Earth version, 1986-2011. We're in the process of splitting off the pages, which, in the case of Superman, is a very big challenge. Until the split is finalized, we're listing only New Earth information in the infobox to make the split easier. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 09:29, July 5, 2013 (UTC) Lois Lane not Wife Why is Lois Lane still Superman's wife on the page. In the Post-Flashpoint, it says that he never developed a romantic relationship between Lois Lane. Lee Eric Etchisen (talk) 16:30, August 19, 2013 (UTC)Lee Eric EtchisenLee Eric Etchisen (talk) 16:30, August 19, 2013 (UTC) :Because it's a page for the pre-Flashpoint Superman. We're in the process of splitting off post-FP material, and in the mean time, we don't use Post-FP info in the infobox. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 16:34, August 19, 2013 (UTC) ::Tupka very patiently just responded to this question, even though he answered a question with a virtually identical answer RIGHT ABOVE THIS QUESTION. ::"This page is for the 'New Earth' version, 1986-2011. We're in the process of splitting off the pages, which, in the case of Superman, is a very big challenge. Until the split is finalized, we're listing only New Earth information in the infobox to make the split easier." :In other words, any information "in the post-flashpoint" is irrelevant to this page. Currently, there is nowhere to put that information, but rest assured that when there is, someone will put it there. - Hatebunny (talk) 16:36, August 19, 2013 (UTC) Recent cleanup With large removals, it's hard to see exactly what got moved and what got axed. So, what did get axed? Also, why is half templated and the rest not? --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 11:01, January 17, 2014 (UTC) Separate Prime Earth page This page is too unorganized and it has out-of universe material (Prime Earth). It gets a little confusing with people, since in the Prime-Earth continuity, Lois Lane and Clark are no longer married (sorry for spoilers), I think there should be a separate page for Superman (Clark Kent) for the New 52 version. Flash (Barry Allen), Wonder Woman (Diana Prince), and a few others have their own Prime Earth pages, why not Superman? - Pokemonmewtwos) :Yes, Superman needs a separate Prime Earth page, and yes, the current content on PE is an unorganized mess. There are a couple people working on early versions. Ask Hatebunny for the things needed for a split. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 00:13, August 22, 2014 (UTC) ::It's been three years since Superman's New 52 version made its first appearance and we haven't made any real progress in separating the New 52 info from the article. How soon can we make an article for New 52 Superman? Leader Vladimir (talk) 20:19, September 12, 2014 (UTC) ::: Have you talked to Hatebunny like Tupka suggested to the other guy? I know there is a page being put together for Prime Earth Supes, but it's a big change. He's not like all the other Prime Earth characters that can simply be created and ignored. Also, just to clarify, for a while we didn't even know what to do with the New 52. It's not like we've been sitting on this page for 3 years. --- Haroldrocks talk 22:30, September 12, 2014 (UTC) :::: I already have a proto-article, if you want to call it, that. You can check it here. Tell me what do you think. Leader Vladimir (talk) 16:34, September 13, 2014 (UTC) New Earth or general Does this page cover the general character of "main continuity" Superman, or only his New Earth (Post-Crisis) and Prime Earth versions? His history and first appearance were listed as Man of Steel, Superman's Post-Crisis origin story. Can anyone clarify? TheD3xus (talk) 18:04, October 3, 2014 (UTC) :This is the New Earth page for Clark, bro. And from taking a glance at the first appearances you were speaking of, those were retcons within Pre-Flashpoint Universe in which they changed his first appearance a bunch of times. Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 18:08, October 3, 2014 (UTC) ::SforHope was under the impression that this was his general universe page, and I didn't want to change it until I cleared this issue. I was just talking about Pre-Crisis/Post-Crisis, not really Flashpoint. TheD3xus (talk) 18:14, October 3, 2014 (UTC) :::My mistake I meant "Pre-Flashpoint" not "Post". Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 18:16, October 3, 2014 (UTC) ::::I changed it following other character's pages infoboxes format. I know this is the NE/PE Sups but to me, the first appearance issue in the infobox should be the first time a character ever appeared. See Batman's page, or Green Arrow, or Joker or any other character for an example. I know some characters from alternate timelines have different first appearances, but in the mainstream character page, it should be their first app. ever. If not, then we'll have to start changing every other character's first appearaces to their in-Universe appearances, and I'm not a fan of that. I think I'll ask some admin. -S.S. (talk) 18:28, October 3, 2014 (UTC) :::::There's really no need to. I think it was just a simple error on someone's part. The first appearance of character should be there first appearance ever unless we're referring to an alternate reality character. We usually have the first appearance of the character in general (on the alternate reality pages), in the notes or trivia. Neptune - Everything's impossible until somebody does it. 18:33, October 3, 2014 (UTC) ::::::The issue with this page in specific is that Pre-Crisis Superman's origin is different from Post-Crisis. Batman and Green Arrow had minor changes, but not as many as Superman did. This page's history begins with Man of Steel; the other pages begin with their respective Earth-Two histories because they are very similar. I'd still like to hear from Tupka or Hatebunny. TheD3xus (talk) 18:36, October 3, 2014 (UTC) Article for Prime Earth Superman With the beginning of Convergence and the end of The New 52, the need of an article for Prime Earth Superman is bigger than ever. Batman and Wonder Woman already have their pages ready. What's the progress on Superman's page? Leader Vladimir (talk) 04:50, April 9, 2015 (UTC) : Hatebunny is working on it. From the glances I've seen, it looks pretty good so far. It's not like Supe's page is dire; it doesn't need to be done immediately just because of Convergence. Just know that Hatebunny is working hard on it and telling him to work faster isn't going to make things any easier for him. We'll get the page whenever it's ready. --- Haroldrocks talk 12:22, April 9, 2015 (UTC) Truth It's been two issues into the Truth story arc, and so far it seems the story is being told in non-linear order, which might cause trouble if we want to write info on the biographies. What should we do? Leader Vladimir (talk) 15:51, June 12, 2015 (UTC) :What we should always do when we write biographies: we wait, so we can get a concise summary afterwards. --[[User:Tupka217|'Tupka']]''217'' 16:02, June 12, 2015 (UTC) Suggestions Superman (Clark Kent) should show the current version of the character and Kal-El (Prime_Earth) could redirect to the page. It makes one year that User:Leader_Vladimir/Kal-El_(Prime_Earth) is under construction and has not yet been added. Kal-El (New Earth) should show the Pre-Flashpoint version in the same way that outors articles are organized. Clark Kent should never be counted as alias because that is the name that won the adoptive parents and not randomly chosen to use as a disguise. If you see in Wikipedia, you will see how they organized. This is confusing. Agente Leite (talk) 17:14, October 11, 2015 (UTC) Prime Earth Why is has it taken so long to develop a Superman (Prime Earth) page? I mean Batman, Wonder Woman, Nightwing, Cyborg, Supergirl, Superboy, Aquaman, Hawkman, Raven, Starfire, Red Hood, Damian Wayne, Barbara Gordon, Hal Jordan and the other Lanterns, all four major Flash characters, and several others have been made. Why is it that this one has taken so long? --Jax Vos 20:53, October 26, 2015 (UTC) :Mostly because Morrison's Action Comics was a huge pain the ass to dissect and turn into a read-able character bio (I did finally manage it, though), and then nobody wanted to read Lobdell's Superman run, because it was terrible. (And the only person who did read it doesn't seem to understand how to be effectively concise). - Hatebunny (talk) 22:12, October 26, 2015 (UTC) All pages of Superman are full of problems and errors. Speaking of mistakes, beginning by adoptive name be treated as code name, like Clark Kent was never adopted and the other is disorganization because the page contains information for Prime-Earth and New Earth versions and to make matters worse, only authorized persons can edit these pages. Agente Leite (talk) 15:10, October 27, 2015 (UTC) :That's actually what he's working on is splitting / cleaning up the page. Let's not get too negative here. Hatebunny is more than qualified to rewrite the page. He has made a lot of progress per his sandbox page. He will hopefully get to posting it to the public space soon so that others can help complete it as a wiki project. The current page is open for editing if you have edited here enough times.--Unatratnag (talk) 18:40, October 27, 2015 (UTC)